10 Replies Latest reply on Aug 27, 2016 1:42 AM by alangodfrey

    Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system

    Cécile

      We manage a lot of "stories" (complaints) and decisions as well as the Codes of Ethic we apply in our evaluation of the cases. As I am designing our new system, I want to improve dramatically our search ability by giving it the flexibility tags allow, without getting the information spread wider than necessary across too many tag words.

       

      Maybe there is already a plugin that exist for what i want to do; I'm just too new to FM to know about it.

       

      Here are the challenges.

       

      • I want the ability to aggregate tags to the pool but only if it is unique enough; otherwise, I want it to be added to a "tag family" (cluster of related words/expressions).
      • The tag familly should be able to contain misspellings, disregard accents, dashes, separate or joined composed words (non-related, nonrelated, non related, non relié, not related)
      • Some repeat across families should yield all the families for the user to pick the appropriate tag.
      • We need to be able to log and search in either French or English without it affecting the number of results obtained.
      • Ideally autosuggestions/autocomplete as we type
      • The app should test the word entered to suggest a family if one exist that has semantic relation with the word entered
      • Adding new tags should be automatic and done on the spot by user confirmation
      • Any member of the family represent the entire family (the repeats across families should pop up a unique individual from the desired family in parentheses: eg: siblings(sister)

       

      EX:

      Soup{broth, bouillon, soupe, consommé, potage, cream, chowder, chaudrée}

      Food poisoning {Intoxication alimentaire, contamination, e. coli, indigestion, vomiting, diarrhea, vomissements, diarrhée, poison}

      Contest {concours, jeux, games, bingo, lotterie, lottery, épreuve, event}

        • 1. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
          alangodfrey

          I'm unclear about the user interface, and how the tags will be assigned.  It is easy to:

          - have a Parent-Child pair of tables that have a one-to-many between 'Soup' and 'broth', 'bouillon', soupe, etc

          - so selecting any Parent can show you all the children.

          - a child may be in two Families, so when you choose the 'Child' it will show all the Families it belongs to.

          - if you mean to only tag the record with a Family tag then clearly that is simple to 'Find' in any search.

          - If you mean to Tag only with Family tags (eg: 'Soup'), but want to search using the term 'broth' then that is easy, too (although the search will be slower).

           

          As I said, I'm confused by the workflow.  Does the user type a saga of a story, and as they type a word it will offer them a tag, show similar tags, allow them in a click to add the tag?

          Or do they type up the story, then tag it independently with a number of tags chosen from the Family name or the 'Child' name?

          When would they be family be 'suggested'?

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          • 2. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
            Cécile

            Thanks for your questions.

            ATM we would limit the tagging to an operator (although it would be great that selfservice complaint filing complainants could do it but without the maintenance or creation ability)

             

            OK here is the regular workflow:

            ______________

            1. Complaint received (either via webform,email, fax letter etc) and prepped (scanned, etc) ->
            2. Logs into FM db from layout "Create complaint"
            • Stores the material received [TO "Exhibit"] ->
            • Creates DB Object representation "Complaint" [TO "Complaint" Which fields are attributes of the complaint such as IdComplaint, Subject, DateReceived, Provider. Some fields are populated automatically with material collected through the webform. However some fields, like the one which is in cause in this discussion, the "TAGsubjectmatter field", are populated by the complaint officer who logs the complaint and documents/qualifies "the message meaning"]

            ________________

            Note.... I changed the word family for Set. Shorter and less confusing for user.

             

            Now, here is the "ugly" but compact layout that would pop when the complaint officer click on the "TAGsubjectmatter" field.

            1. Is there any other way to achieve (creation, selection, maintenance) of the tags that would be even simpler?
            2. What does the "back-end" of the search and Tag sets look like? TO? Variable?

             

            TAGS Management.jpg

            • 3. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
              alangodfrey

              Typing in the field 'Type a word that would make a good tag for this complaint' could produce a (reducing) list of tag words in the portal below it (the 'Suggested set').  The list could reduce as the user typed more letters.  Would it show Tag Words, or Family (Set) Names?

               

              Clicking the Tag Word in the resulting list could add it to the 'Tags Suggested' list.  (The Tag Word, or the Set Name of that Tag Word?)

               

              Clicking 'Apply selected tags' could add them to the Complaint being assessed.

              The fields you show here would be globals, allowing the user to 'mess about'.  Then when they confirmed their Tags were correct, they would be added to the Complaint by the 'Apply selected...' button.

               

              Yes?

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              • 4. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
                Cécile

                First I'm sorry, I have not seen your reply! These excellent questions had me think!!

                 

                Typing in the field 'Type a word that would make a good tag for this complaint' could produce a (reducing) list of tag words in the portal below it (the 'Suggested set').

                Yes, that is the intent here (although I do not know how to script this "give suggestions as I type" function) .

                 

                The list could reduce as the user typed more letters. Would it show Tag Words, or Family (Set) Names?

                 

                I'm not sure I know what difference you see there... My initial thought was to display the whole set with their leader like this (the leader would be either one of the two first elements in the list, depending whether the complaint is in French or English):

                item {item, thing, chose, element, élément, object, objet}

                idem {same, même, identical, identique, similar, similaire}

                choice {choix, choose, chose, chosen, choisit, choisis, choisi, choisie,  selection, sélection, select, sélectionner, option, decision, décision}

                twin {jumeau, jumelle, sibling, frère, soeur}

                 


                Clicking the Tag Word in the resulting list could add it to the 'Tags Suggested' list. (The Tag Word, or the Set Name of that Tag Word?)

                 

                Mmm. the Set Leader for that Tag Word would be better and easier for standardization, the Tag Word would be better for Tag maintenance and trend analysis... I would be tempted to go with the latter but only IF it remains possible in Reports or Search to get the results by either Tag Set Leaders or by Word Tag (I like that you clarified the distinct notion for me!)

                 

                Clicking 'Apply selected tags' could add them to the Complaint being assessed.

                The fields you show here would be globals, allowing the user to 'mess about'. Then when they confirmed their Tags were correct, they would be added to the Complaint by the 'Apply selected...' button.

                 

                Yes?

                Yes :-)

                • 5. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
                  alangodfrey

                  This is a crude file to see if I understand the concepts.  There is nothing pretty about it - no navigation, no checking for mis-click by the user if they add a wrong tag, no button to remove tags, there are unnecessary fields on display, etc.

                   

                  The layouts are:

                  - Story: Enter the text of the story and click to add a tag (and its Family Name).  You can type in the filter box at the top of the tags-to-choose listing and it will show a reducing list

                  - Story tags: this is a utility table to track which Tags have been tagged to which Stories.

                  -

                  Tag Family: lets you assign a Tag to a Family (and create new Families, obviously).  Just add a new tag to the bottom line of the portal.

                   

                  You can search Stories that have any Tag or Tag Family assigned to them.

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                  • 6. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
                    Cécile

                    Oh my!

                    This is more than perfect! I did not expect a solution. This wow. Thank you so much! I will play with it and get back to you!

                    • 7. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
                      alangodfrey

                      It was intended as an extension or clarification of the questions. There are lots of neat interface features that could be built into your solution - you just need to confirm exactly how you want them to work to suit your workflow.

                       

                      (Am I the only person the world who hates - with a passion - the word 'workflow'?  Must be something subliminal in my childhood.)

                      • 8. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
                        alangodfrey

                        Here's an update.  No fancy error trapping, etc, but shows another couple of techniques:

                        - see a list of all Stories with any of the same tags as this one

                        - click to see that Story in full

                        - hover to see a 'preview' of the Story before you click

                        - remove an added tag

                        - hover to see all members of a Family

                         

                        I don't know what you know (and I'm still kinda struggling with what you want exactly) so I don't know what techniques to add.

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                        • 9. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
                          Cécile

                          I never use the word workflow. It does not compute to anything in my brain. Its too general. I prefer process, activity, action, sequence, module, heck even goal feels more descriptive. I know those are not the "industry lingo".. Idc... lol

                           

                          I don't know much on the developing side. My strenght is conceptual (workflows lmao - business processes) and creative with a very strong user pov yet an understanding of technology capabilities and limitation. I have used FM quite much over the last year but as a user of a DB that has been winged together and patched up over the years. FM7. We are a small team (3 employees and the Chair).

                           

                          Our company paid a big amount to have a new DB built with CRM. Not only did it not do the stuff we needed to improve but it did not pair up to what our old fm custom system was doing.  After keeping up with both db during 5 months (I KNEW crm was a flop but given that I was the new hire and that they had worked 18 mo with the consultant to create that thing, I kept a low profile but made sure we could revert when needed) my boss finally had had enough himself of the nonsense and Okayed the abandon of that money pit. I suggested that I do proper process mapping (that had not been done by the consultation firm!!!!) and then explore new solutions and come up with a plan.

                          OKayed on that, I started looking around and... eventually came to the conclusion that FM was a very solid platform that had served us for over 15 years and that I could probably develop the new DB myself. They relieved me from my function for the summer, been cramming on process and such and am now designing the interface. The goal will be missed, but that was to be expected (September first is the start of our new fiscal year). I'm targeting October 1st for what I call the "Hybrid". I am renaming, remapping old fields, deprecating some, repurposing others but not in the old file. I am creating a new file, just uploading content to appropriate places to accelerate testing and such. The Hybrid will have as many of the new functionalities as I can put to ease my function (I'm front line so to be able to free some of my time to continue this project, I have to implement the changes that will automate and simplify my business function.

                           

                          I have built UAT tests for deployment of a CMS at a university, I have developed an add-in for Word as a personal project product development I was coding simple stuff in VBA and hired an expert to do the stuff beyond my capacity.

                          I can read code, I understand dependencies very well. I can listen and interject wisely in IT meetings. I can draw representations of concepts and process maps as well as accurate infographics. I've unhappily been in the shoes of a secretary or executive assistant for about 20 years, until 2013 when someone saw a conceptor in me. So that is what I bring to the table.

                           

                          Now that you have confirmed that a lot of what i wanted to do is implementable, I will spend the week-end clarifying my next steps and needs and get back to you. I'm very excited. This is so promising. The functionality you added will totally kill our policy director! She as been longing for that sort of things for 13 years!!!

                          Thank you again.

                          • 10. Re: Strategy help - Bilingual tagging system
                            alangodfrey

                            You presumably want to nominate a list as being in French or English.  This version has a more helpful display of the tag's Family Name, but also lets you choose whether you want to see English or French tags to choose from.  (You specify the language of the Family when you create the Family.)