12 Replies Latest reply on Sep 22, 2016 12:30 AM by bigtom

    Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI

    c0nsilience

      Hi Devs,

       

      So, I've been playing around with Swift Playgrounds for a little while in my spare time and I think it's a great primer for Swift.

       

      Why hasn't anyone done something like this with FileMaker?  Specifically, I think it would really benefit those brand new to the platform with some of the higher level functionality (i.e., advanced scripting, custom functions, ExecuteSQL, etc.).

       

      Video tutorials are great, as well as, white papers and PDFs, but nothing would really top hands-on in a "puzzle" like environment.

       

      What do you think?

       

      Anyone from FMI care to chime in? = )

       

      Thanks!

        • 1. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
          CarstenLevin

          Hi cOnsilience,

           

          Is this question really thought through. FileMaker and it's relational model and programming/scriptworkspace give you direct access to se the result in real life.

          And FileMaker is a development platform to build business solutions.

           

          Do not expect FMI to chime in, but consider elaborating a little bit. What should this do, achieve and what is the business case?

           

          Best regards

           

          Carsten

          • 2. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
            hankshrier

            FMP does have advanced scripting and custom functions.  They also publish an extensive traing eries that take a new user from Hello to Application.   I don't work for FMI, nor to I have any vested interest in the outcome.

            • 3. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
              beverly

              my guess is that anyone wanting to do Swift, is doing Swift with or without FileMaker.

              beverly

              • 4. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
                c0nsilience

                Carsten Levin wrote:

                 

                Hi cOnsilience,

                 

                Is this question really thought through. FileMaker and it's relational model and programming/scriptworkspace give you direct access to se the result in real life.

                And FileMaker is a development platform to build business solutions.

                 

                Do not expect FMI to chime in, but consider elaborating a little bit. What should this do, achieve and what is the business case?

                 

                Best regards

                 

                Carsten

                Carsten,

                 

                Thank you for the response.  Here's an example to further elaborate:

                 

                A lot of individuals are not that great at mathematics, or do not care for it.  Probably a high percentage of them are not that great at math because of the way they were taught/learned it...in a silo'd system without much application.  Rote memorization, boring formulas, the "why this is useful" might have never clicked.  Now imagine if they had learned math in a hands-on fashion, with pure application and results that are both immediate and useful (i.e., taught with other disciplines...fractions with culinary recipes or chemistry; algebra with balancing a checkbook or building a desk, etc.).  We might have a lot more folks that are good at/enjoy math.

                 

                I'd imagine that FM training is a nice and niche cottage industry with all of the video tutorials and trainer-led courses, culminating in certification.  What if that same training could be developed in a more interactive fashion beyond a sample file and a pdf?  It's true that FM's programming/script workspace gives you direct access to see the result in real life, but only if you know what you're doing already.  If you're a neophyte and run a script debugger in FMPA, chances are you may not see anything happen on a layout.

                 

                Check out the Swift Playgroud app and tell me it wouldn't be really neat to have a FileMaker Playground app of sorts.

                 

                Best,

                 

                Ben

                • 5. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
                  c0nsilience

                  beverly wrote:

                   

                  my guess is that anyone wanting to do Swift, is doing Swift with or without FileMaker.

                  beverly

                  Beverly,

                   

                  I don't mean learning Swift in FileMaker, but rather learning FileMaker in the style of the Swift Playground.  If you have iOS 10, check it out.

                   

                  Thanks!

                   

                  Ben

                  • 6. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
                    beverly

                    ah! as a training method, how Swift Playgrounds teaches you Swift. Got it. I have a book that taught Basic (& another that taught Pascal) using Sherlock Holmes "stories". It was fun.

                    Yes, make it easy like learning turtle graphics (Logo) or using a Koala Pad....

                    beverly

                    • 7. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
                      bigtom

                      I have a slow moving project for a series to help kids learn FileMaker. Why is it slow moving? I am busy with other stuff, it takes a lot of resources to support a good teaching program, and it really is not as widely useful as Swift. It would be a great gateway to kids understanding databases and some other programatic things.

                       

                      I do think it is a great way to get people growing up with the platform and knowing when to use it and how to use it. The best and brightest ideas by majority come from people age 14-25. I do not see anyone tapping into that group with FileMaker.

                       

                      I have played Playgrounds for a while and it is getting better, but still needs improvement. I remember how I learned Apple Basic as a kid. The desire to learn was the key component.

                       

                      I read Alice in Quantumland  as course recommended reading for quantum physics. It did really help with the theories and basic concepts even though it was not a direct teaching tool. Something like that may need to be a video nowadays though.

                      • 8. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
                        macwombat

                        bigtom wrote:

                         

                        The best and brightest ideas by majority come from people age 14-25. I do not see anyone tapping into that group with FileMaker.

                        Which is a considerable concern for the platform.  I've never had the opportunity to go to an FM DevCon but from what I've heard the average age is considerably higher than 25.

                         

                        It would be great if FMI did develop some methodology for engaging with younger people to help them see the possibilities for using FM.  Good on you bigtom for starting on a tool for teaching kids about FM and databases - hope you find the time to finish it.

                        • 9. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
                          bigtom

                          Chris Cullen wrote:

                           

                          I've never had the opportunity to go to an FM DevCon but from what I've heard the average age is considerably higher than 25.

                           

                          I would say the average age is somewhere just under 40 form my observation.

                          • 10. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
                            c0nsilience

                            Not to hijack my own thread, but if the average age of the majority of DevCon attendees is just under 40, we are talking Gen X'ers.  Whereas I think the average age of FMI's intended target market (i.e., small to medium-sized business owners) is going to be around 50.

                             

                            Keep in mind, the median age of iPhone users is 35; iPad users is 41 and the average age of all  customers combined is 35-44.

                             

                            What does all this mean?  It means that a majority of FM Devs, small business owners and Apple customers all belong to Generation X.

                             

                            Why does it matter? We are collectively pondering training for Millennials and beyond.

                             

                            How do you develop adequate and engaging training for folks that may not fully understand "delayed gratification" are more used to Facebook than fresh air and possess an ever-decreasing attention span?

                            1 of 1 people found this helpful
                            • 11. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
                              CarstenLevin

                              I am afraid that statistic is not your strength ... assuming that the figures you start with are correct.

                              Keep in mind, the median age of iPhone users is 35; iPad users is 41 and the average age of all  customers combined is 35-44.

                               

                              What does all this mean?  It means that a majority of FM Devs, small business owners and Apple customers all belong to Generation X.

                              Minor detail ... the average age is probably not 35-44 but one figure.

                              But then let's assume that it is 40. That would actually imply that FM users would be either all just around 35-44 or since many are 50-60 really many would have to be 18-40 to hit your assumed area point.

                               

                              But since I do not have any reliable figures I will leave this behind and go to another point. You correctly conclude that most FileMaker developers (as well as most Oracle and MySQL developers) belong to generation X ... and not generation Y. At least when looking at it statistically. But you forget that IT generations are not defines by "age" only ... but by typical attributes. One of them being growing up with the internet, social media, being perpetually online, mobile etc.

                               

                              The FileMaker developers have, at least many of them have, been first movers ...  and innovation-vise ahead of their own generation. Probably on the internet already in 1994, 10 or more years before most of their peers.

                               

                              This is not the same as concluding that we do not need thousands of young FileMaker developers from generation Y and even more important from generation Z!

                               

                              A good article to read: Millennials - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

                              • 12. Re: Why hasn't anyone done this yet? - to Devs and FMI
                                bigtom

                                I do not know if the iPhone age data is truly reliable, but I know a lot of people have done a lot of studies. Just a few years ago the average age of iPhone users was 24. I suspect the sharp rise in age was from older people getting smartphones for various reasons and ending up with iPhones. I know I recently purchased iPhones for older family members to have mainly for the FaceTime capability. There are 3 people in their 60s using iPhones in this world because I needed them to have the technology. Not by their choice. The do not use apps. They make calls, check emails, and take photos...lots of photos.

                                 

                                When you think in terms of databases, FM people and FMI are ahead of the rest in embracing new things. In terms of Application development we do our best wishing the limits of the product.

                                 

                                My point is that young people do not come with any habits or other baggage and the tend to see things and try things that do not make sense, but somehow find a way to make it useful. If you had young people writing plugins...amazing things might happen.

                                 

                                There was actually a whole session on how to bring new developers to FM. I firmly feel one of the most effective ways is working with young people. I have a basic curriculum outlined and some start on the visuals. The difficult part is certainly finding quality instructors. This may even lead to some people being certified in the previous 6 versions and with 8+ years experience by the time they leave college and some of those may end up at FMI straight out of school.