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Timestamp: not recorded

Question asked by sorysm on Jan 17, 2018
Latest reply on Jan 17, 2018 by sorysm

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Hi,

I work with a database with multiple timestamp for each record. My calculations depends on them. There are many people pulling data, most of which are not familiar with databases at all.

For that reason I do not want to change the format that I picked: mm/dd/yyyy hh:mm. That avoids different formats that could impede calculations.

However, sometimes the timestamp is not available. Is there any way of adding a dropdown including: "Not recorded" without getting a error message?

Any help is welcomed.

Thank you!

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jbrown Jan 17, 2018 7:34 AM
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A timestamp field will only take a timestamp-formatted piece of text. So I don't think there's a way to enter data into that field.

You could add another calc field with the calc: If (IsEmpty (YourTSField) ; "Not recorded" ; YourTSField) then you could do your calculations of this calc field. But how would you calculate off a field that says "Not Recorded"?
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sorysm @ jbrown on Jan 17, 2018 7:50 AM
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Thank you!

I thought about that, but that would mean adding like literally 200 fields more because we have many timestamps fields. I was trying to avoid that people is checking many times the same fields because they see them empty...

If there is nothing or a non numerical value they are automatically ignored from the calculations, so that would not be a problem.
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philmodjunk Jan 17, 2018 7:58 AM
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How do you (and in what context) do you record this timestamp?
Perhaps a text field with "not recorded" as it's default value. You'd then use a script or auto-enter calculation to capture the timestamp, but as text not a timestamp. You'd then use the GetAsTimeStamp function in your calculations to extract the value as a timestamp.

Alternatively, you could define "not recorded" as placeholder text on a timestamp field. Then any empty field will show "not recorded" until a timestamp is entered.

But "200 [timestamp] fields", sounds like you might also be much better off redesigning your data model so that those become multiple records rather than multiple fields. That would then make the calculation field option already recommended much more practical as you might need only one such calculation field.
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jbrown @ sorysm on Jan 17, 2018 8:09 AM
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What are the timestamp fields used for? Maybe you could consider putting those in a child table with a description by them rather than having 200 separate fields?
However, since you've already developed this, I guess I'd just either put in placeholder text or hide them if empty and instead show "Not recorded".
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sorysm @ philmodjunk on Jan 17, 2018 8:11 AM
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Hi,

This is a patients database. We record many times for each patient:
ER arrival time, MD Initial Assessment, Chest X ray Results, ER left, Surgery time (room, procedure, start, end...), Swallow date and time, first medication, patient in CT, CT started, CT results, CT info tell to MD ER... Believe it or not, there can be easily 200 timestamps associated with each patient (record)...
The calculations are made to see the processes times and look for outliers.

The info is pulled for the clinical people treating the patients, so if they say not recorded, they may not look for it in the chart, because they could assume they are not going to find it.

Having said that, it may be better having those fields just blank either you still have not pulled the information or there is not information to pull in...

THANK YOU!
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sorysm @ sorysm on Jan 17, 2018 8:12 AM
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When I said say I meant see
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jbrown @ sorysm on Jan 17, 2018 8:20 AM
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If you do have a chance, consider redesigning the system. One patient record has many timestamp events. That sounds like a one-to-many relationship. All you'd have to do in the child table is store three fields: ID_PatientRecord (or your foreign key), Event, and Timestamp.
That's easy data entry. If you do need all of the possible events, you can generate them on new patient record creation and then, as Phil says, put the placeholder text "Not Recorded" in the the (real) timestamp field.

If you need to do calcs between certain events, that can be handled as well.
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philmodjunk Jan 17, 2018 8:18 AM
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Believe it or not, there can be easily 200 timestamps associated with each patient (record)...
Yes, but just as in Invoice can consist of a parent record with many line item records associated with it, your patient record can consist of Parent record with potentially many related detail records. This might reduce the total number of fields--both simplifying the issue at hand and giving you more "narrow" tables with a possible improvement in performance.

I am suggesting a possibility for you to explore for future improvements.
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jbrown @ jbrown on Jan 17, 2018 8:33 AM
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If you can't redesign, then simply select all the timestamp fields (can do this quickly in FM 16's layout object inspector) and add the "Not Recorded" placeholder text.
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sorysm Jan 17, 2018 8:34 AM
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That sounds interesting... I think I will have to explore it. I am an MD doing research, so even if this is my design I am still a rookie with FMP.

This is how it is designed:

-There is a Matrix layout who contains all patients that come to the hospital, and the timestamps (and clinical info) that all of them share.
-There are other 4 layouts in which patient are included only if they have a determinate condition or procedure, with timestamps (and clinical info) specific for that situation.
-They have a number that is specific for each admission and a number that is specific for each patient. The admission number allows us to share information between the different layouts. The patient number, having a counter for the actual number of patients that come and go so we can track readmissions.

Some patients are only included in the matrix layout, while others are in all of them. When it comes to procedures, the same patient can have multiple during the same admission. So there is also a number to identify each procedure.

I would be happy to learn anyway of improving it. Also, if there is any place where I can read about this.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
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sorysm @ jbrown on Jan 17, 2018 8:39 AM
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Thank you! I think I will do that, so far...
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