1 2 Previous Next 19 Replies Latest reply on Jan 17, 2013 5:07 PM by lkeyes

    Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system

    intex

      We definetely need kind of Filemaker GO for the desktop when you take the following arguments into consideration:

       

      - FM GO is, what most pure users like secretaries, case handlers, workers etc. need. Not everybody wants to create databases, not everybody wants to change given databases. To the contrary companies want their employees doing their work and not playing around with possibilities of something. Plus - although FileMaker is proud to be a desktop database for the average user - most people wouldn´t be able to create or change a database. Probably they don´t even want to.

      - FM GO costs nothing and can connect to a FileMaker PRO hosted database or to a server. Why the hell does the same for the desktop cost 400.- Euros per seat ? You can´t explain that to those, who just want to use a database solution (see first point)

      - Runtimes cost nothing, but they can´t connect to a server. Why, when the costless FM GO can do that ? This is nothing you can explain to anybody. It tends to be cheaper buying an iPad and using FileMaker from there than buying the desktop software. This is ridiculous.

      - Networking on the desktop is just too expensive. Take a 99.- Euro solution based on the runtime. It can be used  as single user or by multiple users (not simultaneously, installed on a NAS). It can be used on iOS devices too. If you want to use the same solution let´s say on three desktop seats simultaneously, it gets 1200.- Euros more expensive just for FileMaker creating no obvious other benefit for the customer. For what with regard to the people mentioned in the first point ? These people want the solution, not FileMaker. In the end, they don´t buy anything, not from us and not from FileMaker, since these potential customers just think we are going crazy when it comes to networking. FileMaker is loosing these startup customers too.

      - Bento is networkable. This small, cheap solution can do, what isn´t possible for the big brother without handing out thousands of Euros. It is just head shaking.

       

      Solution:

       

      a) a networkable runtime (able to connect to a FM PRO or Server), perhaps the Advanced version could be more expensive for that. This would dramatically cut the cost in the first place and keep people thinking about a FileMaker based solution. Today they are running away.

       

      b) a FM GO or FM Starter or whatever named version of FileMaker without layoutmode and database creation commands for the desktop costing only a little percentage of the fullblown product .

        • 1. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
          andrekv

          +1

           

          Fully support the above post!

          • 2. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
            xetabase

            I've pointed out the exact same problem to my FileMaker rep.   The standard FMPRO application is way too complicated for 99% of the users, and it's way overpriced.  There's an urgent need for a cheap FMGO equivalent for the desktop, otherwise Filemaker will become irrelevant as everything moves over to browser-hosted cloud solutions.

            • 3. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
              powell

              I totally agree with you!

              Me too would like something like this:

              • a FM Pro Advanced Developer edition
              • it price could be up to €1000

              This would give the developer a Runtime allowing:

              • 3/max 5 simultaneous network connections (for more than that the client would be suggested, not to say constrained, to buy FM server)
              • charts

              All this would make FM a true RAD and also help FM penetration in companies.

              • 4. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                PeterWindle

                I'd be happy if FileMaker just FIX the darn problems with FileMaker 12 ! I have a client who has paid GOOD MONEY for a server and 10 user license, they have a problem that FileMaker have acknowledged as being "an issue" and does FileMaker even give me a hint at when or if they're going to fix it... nope. Grrr...

                 

                Go ahead, make FM Go free, it's given me lots of work! Go ahead, consider giving a "thin client" for cross platform Mac/PC, but PLEASE look after your existing PAYING customers!

                 

                end of rant

                • 5. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                  intex

                  great to have some supporters :-) Anyone else ?

                  • 6. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                    Steve Wright

                    xetabase wrote:

                     

                    The standard FMPRO application is way too complicated for 99% of the users, and it's way overpriced.  There's an urgent need for a cheap FMGO equivalent for the desktop, otherwise Filemaker will become irrelevant as everything moves over to browser-hosted cloud solutions.

                     

                    I totally agree.  99.5% of my clients have absolutely zero interest in 'creating' anything with FileMaker, 98.5% of them have no idea what FileMaker is.    My clients are not in the IT industry, they are not programmers, designers or anything of the sort.  They are in their own industry and what we supply to them is a tool.  They dont care how that tool was made just as long as it performs the job its meant to.

                     

                    Anyway, I personally would love to see options similar to how another "product" does it:

                     

                    FileMaker Pro Advanced 'Runtime Bundles'

                    These would allow you to build networkable runtimes upto the current peer to peer limit of 10 users depending on the licence bought, so they are already limited.

                    Runtime Plus 2:  Unlimited client entities, upto 2 seats per client.

                    Runtime Plus x:  Unlimited client entities, upto x seats per client upto 10 max.

                     

                    Licences are locked to a single solution, so for instance you could have a Runtime 5 licence for XYZ Widgets and sell a 5 concurrent user system to unlimited clients

                    but also have a Runtime 10 licence for ABC Blocks and sell a 10 concurrent user system to unlimited clients.
                    Each Runtime Plus licence pack is prices appropriately.

                     

                    To stop it hurting sales of Pro, if indeed it ever would  It could have no ability to connect to FileMaker Server, thats what Pro or a Thin client is for.

                     

                     

                    This would open a market for budget FileMaker based solutions, which is currently not possible. For a 2 concurrent user system the lowest price is already way beyond that of comparible solutions especially in todays world of £/$0.99 apps not only for mobile anymore, but also for desktop users.  Bento comes to mind here, but its not the same thing at all, aside from being created by FMI.  Altough its cheap with sharing facilites.

                     

                     

                    Of course, a thin client would be great too, I dont understand why a full system capable of creating complete solutions is required just to connect to a host, other than money of course.
                    I know there is an option to prevent creation of databases via a silent install, but thats not really the point.

                     

                    Edit: However, I can hazzard a guess that licencing for "FM Pro as Clients" is where the money is made, so to cut into that and offer something free could be disastrous for FMI. 

                    But it is funny how you can almost buy an ipad, get Go free and be a full client for similar costs to a desktop application to do the same thing.
                    I wonder if Apple had any influence for driving Business Sales?

                    • 7. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                      mikeinhawaii

                      They already did this.  Its called Bento.

                      • 8. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                        intex

                        what a joke - Bento isn´t comparable to FileMaker at all:

                         

                        - no Windows

                        - no scripting

                        - no print layouts

                        - even no if-statements in formulas

                         

                        Bento is just a nice card file box

                        • 9. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                          Datastudio

                          We agree with the post. We loose at least 30-40 potential companies per year based on this issuse because we simply can not explain why the additional costs since there is no significant benefits for them as end users with no programming skills.

                           

                          There is no way to compete with other software companies who use other techonologies.

                           

                          I suggest FileMaker Thin Client for up to 99EUR which sould have same features as FileMaker Pro (PDF, graphs, networking...) but completely without any developer features (managing scripts, database etc.).

                           

                          We are convinced that this would be win/win for us as developers and FIleMaker.

                          • 10. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                            jrenfrew

                            Do Apple make more money selling an iPad or a copy of FMpro?

                             

                            If it is the former then from there perspective its not difficult to allow this situation.

                            That and the philosophical belief that desktops are going to be 'legacy' in the not too distant future.

                             

                            Might not be so useful for us, but its not part of their company ethos to keep us all working in ways we 'like'

                            I wonder if we are in danger of becoming a bit Luddite in our approach to this question?

                            • 11. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                              intex

                              I really don´t believe that desktop computing will be outdated sometime near in the future or perhaps even ever.

                               

                              Who will be doing accounting, ERP, taxation or other serious business stuff in the wild, sitting in a canoe or surfing on the waves using his iPad or other mobile gadget ? I don´t believe in that. There will be still bureaus with office desks as long as I live I guess.

                               

                              All this mobility stuff is a kind of hype and when gasoline will cost 5 Euros or even more per litre, people will return to their homes and offices and stay where they are ...

                              • 12. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                                xetabase

                                I don't agree with the suggestions regarding networkable runtimes.  Any active business with multiple employees will need a system that expands and grows with the company.  Constantly building and swapping new runtimes for each employee would be a support headache that nobody wants.  A lightweight client like FMGO on the desktop is the right solution. 

                                 

                                FileMaker's original business model (circa 1985) is no longer viable now that the web browser is an ubiquitous and very inexpensive platform.  Companies today want to start and mange their business as quickly and cheaply as possible, and using a $300 development app for each seat is not an appealing solution.  Filemaker needs to update their business model to reflect this reality.

                                 

                                From my perspective Filemaker's product line should be simplified down to three items:

                                 

                                FMServer for hosting (single version incorporating features of Server Advanced)

                                FMPro for development (single version incorporating features of Pro Advanced)

                                FMClient for mobile and desktop

                                 

                                I'd like to see FMClient at a price low enough that it can be absorbed by the developer and not billed separately to the customer.  This would be viable at a retail price under $100, or alternately a yearly license fee around $20 per desktop.  At these price points I think Filemaker would see a very substantial increase in sales volume that would offset the reduced profit per seat. 

                                 

                                I will be very surprised if Filemaker doesn't address this issue within the coming year, and very disappointed if they do nothing and allow their entire market to slip out of their hands.

                                • 13. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                                  jormond

                                  xetabase wrote:

                                   

                                  I don't agree with the suggestions regarding networkable runtimes.  Any active business with multiple employees will need a system that expands and grows with the company.  Constantly building and swapping new runtimes for each employee would be a support headache that nobody wants.  A lightweight client like FMGO on the desktop is the right solution. 

                                   

                                  FileMaker's original business model (circa 1985) is no longer viable now that the web browser is an ubiquitous and very inexpensive platform.  Companies today want to start and mange their business as quickly and cheaply as possible, and using a $300 development app for each seat is not an appealing solution.  Filemaker needs to update their business model to reflect this reality.

                                   

                                  From my perspective Filemaker's product line should be simplified down to three items:

                                   

                                  FMServer for hosting (single version incorporating features of Server Advanced)

                                  FMPro for development (single version incorporating features of Pro Advanced)

                                  FMClient for mobile and desktop

                                   

                                  I'd like to see FMClient at a price low enough that it can be absorbed by the developer and not billed separately to the customer.  This would be viable at a retail price under $100, or alternately a yearly license fee around $20 per desktop.  At these price points I think Filemaker would see a very substantial increase in sales volume that would offset the reduced profit per seat. 

                                   

                                  I will be very surprised if Filemaker doesn't address this issue within the coming year, and very disappointed if they do nothing and allow their entire market to slip out of their hands.

                                   

                                  Agreed.  For the same reason Go is free, it would help those still using Desktops...which is most of the business world. Mobile has a large place in the business world...but it's simply not a replacement for most businesses for a variety of reasons.

                                   

                                  I don't see a Go-like Desktop client hurting Pro sales that much.  Maybe a tiny bit in the beginning...but this I know: Developers will still develop.  Small business owners will still want to build themselves a solution to help their business.  And businesses with a custom/in-house solution will find it impossible to get what FM gives them if their per seat cost was 1/3 of what it is now.  Other businesses will see it as low-hanging fruit...try it...love it...buy Advanced and thin-client seat for each workstation or hire a developer.  All around, it's a big boost for FM in the business world.

                                  • 14. Re: Kind of FM GO for the desktop operating system
                                    Steve Wright

                                    Networkable runtimes with the current limits imposed on peer to peer networking would as I mentioned, open up a market for budget software, I was not talking large corporations who spend thousands on software.

                                     

                                    I was thinking small.. hence the budget comments.

                                     

                                    Whilst this is probably extreme, lets say I wanted to create small app to be used over a few home systems (to sell of course) no home user is going to pay FM prices.  So I cant go ahead and build something like this lets say:

                                    http://www.spelgasoftware.co.uk/PhoneLog/phonelogpro.html

                                     

                                    The above is a simple dirt cheap database app, I have no idea if it has sharing capabilites etc but seemed fitting.

                                     

                                    Obviously FM is not the right tool for the job, but it could be, thats what I was getting at.

                                    Please dont mention bento.. thats definitaly not the right tool for the job.

                                     

                                    Edit, yes I know I can create a runtime and give it away, but at least allow 'some' multi user connections, even if its two or three.

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