1 2 3 Previous Next 36 Replies Latest reply on Dec 4, 2013 1:12 PM by intex

    New features not designed as well as they could

    intex

      Nearly two years ago I wrote something like "features are not thought through to the end". And now testing FM13 I get the impression that FM still isn´t thinking further than to the next corner. Examples ? Yes:

       

      - The new popovers. They are nice, but they could have been so much more versatile, if the developer could decide how they are closed. Now they are getting closed as soon as the user is clicking somewhere. This way popovers can´t function as dialogues, what would have been nice, since the "new window" script step can´t produce dialogues. Every input in a popover is saved automatically, no chance for OK and Abort buttons. Furthermore, popups can´t easily include general help stuff like clocks, calendars, calculators etc., since they are bound to a specific layout. They could have been so much more helpful, if the content of a popover simply could have been just another layout. Then you could centralize helper windows and let them appear in dozens of layouts via popups. Now you will have to copy the same popup from layout to layout or still use windows.

       

      - The new optional screen elements, stuff you can hide if you want. Great. But you can only use this nicely on the right or lower side of a layout, because if these elements are hidden, there is no way of getting the other elements rush more to the left or to the top (like in printing and pageview too). This way you only get funny wholes and space in your layout, but not a responsive layout. Too sad, since that is a little HTML (div style=float:left).

       

      - Nice, that there are new css styles for active records in list view and portals. But why didn´t they think of a hover effect too ?

       

      - Slide controls, nice, but why is there no option for automatic sliding ?

       

      - Webdirect seems to be much more beautifull than IWP ever was, but why is it limited to the server now or why is the server that damn expensive ? For simple input with lets say three or four clients the former IWP with a FM Pro functioning as a server was an affordable option, but now the server is getting even more expensive than having FM Pro installations on each client and doing peer-to-peer networking.

        • 1. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
          taylorsharpe

          When you see things that might be improved, and I like some of your suggestions, go to http://www.filemaker.com/company/contact/feature_request.html and make a suggestion.  FileMaker really makes use of this input.  It won't change what we have now, but it helps them for the next version. 

           

          I, again, cringe hearing using FileMaker Pro client as a server.  It is meant for light duty not mission critical situation like a home with a wife and husband sharing some file.  It is not meant for business purposes.  It is old peer-to-peer technology wrought with problems like lack of encryption, no backup scheduling, etc.  FileMaker is moving more towards cloud and mobile solutions... expect more of an emphasis on the server and, I predict, that peer-to-peer will go away at some point, probably when they try to move the client to 64 bit because they won't want to recreate that old technology. 

           

          But keep looking 13 over and feel free to bounce feature requests off us and then send them to FileMaker!

          • 2. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
            BruceRobertson

            "- The new popovers. They are nice, but they could have been so much more versatile, if the developer could decide how they are closed."

             

            Have you discovered FileMaker scripting yet?

            Have you discovered script triggers?

             

            Scripts and script triggers are basic features of FileMaker development.

             

            Developers decide how to write scripts.

            Popovers have an ObjectExit script trigger.

            • 3. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
              BruceRobertson

              "- Slide controls, nice, but why is there no option for automatic sliding ?"

               

              Again: learn basic FileMaker scripting.

               

              Triggers and Timer scripts have been available for a while now.

              • 4. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                intex

                Have you discovered FileMaker scripting yet?

                 

                you want to insult ?

                 

                I have been developing with FM since FM3, so I know about scripting, and script triggers.

                 

                Onobjectexit is too late for a dialogue, because the script is triggered, when the popover gets closed and you can´t open it by script again (another thing, they forgot). Even with gotoObject or gotofield you can´t reopen the closed popover.

                • 5. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                  intex

                  perhaps you shut up or stop insulting

                   

                  if I wanted to program a slide show myself, I could have done that without FM13.

                   

                  From the new feature "Slide control" I would have expected, that this offers what you normally get with a slider (for example in Bootstrap), and not just a different looking tab control.

                  • 6. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                    erolst


                    intex wrote:

                    I have been developing with FM since FM3, so I know about scripting, and script triggers.

                     

                    Really?

                     

                    Use OnObjectExit with an Exit Script [ result: False ] step and try to exit the popover …

                    • 7. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                      intex

                      Played around with it and it seems to work. But don´t tell me, that this is in any way "obvious". Furthermore it keeps all menu commands active, even those, that are not available. So you would have to develop a second menu set and change to that, when the popup is shown. Wasn´t FileMaker supposed to be an "easy" system for quick development ?

                      • 8. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                        jormond

                        No one is saying everything is obvious...but that much experience with FileMaker, I don't think anyone understands why you expect FileMaker to do everything for you.  If the behavior was the opposite, it feels like the complaints would be about how FM doesn't handle it the other way?!

                         

                        We have this same go-round every time FM releases a new version. All-in-all, this is a good upgrade. It represents significant progress in the evolution of the platform.  Yes, there are a few things I would like to have seen polished up a bit, but it's nothing that my clients/users will ever know about, and my solutions will look and perform better. FileMaker, kudos!!!

                        • 9. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                          erolst

                          It might not be "obvious" to a recent emigrée from Bento land, but it sorta should be if know the tools at your disposal, try to make creative use of them and experiment a bit.

                          So you would have to develop a second menu set and change to that, when the popup is shown. Wasn´t FileMaker supposed to be an "easy" system for quick development ?

                          I guess that's why they pay us the big bucks – nothing happens by itself (ecxept for entropy, but that's another matter …) Also, IIUC a popup is not intended as a modal dialog window – we already have that.

                           

                          And in conclusion I'd like to add that FM 13 is "officially" out for a few hours now; why not take the time to discover the new features for what they can achieve, instead of damning them outright for their perceived (or actual, as it may be) shortcomings?

                          • 10. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                            intex

                            Joshua Ormond schrieb:

                             

                            I don't think anyone understands why you expect FileMaker to do everything for you.

                             

                             

                            I don´t expect, that FileMaker does everything for me. They just can´t and I don´t expect that they would.

                             

                            But if they offer popovers and slidecontrols as bright new features, I do expect that these features make my life easier, need less or close to no additional programming.

                             

                            We had "popovers" already in our own FM11 based solutions (see attachment, the black transparent calendar is a popup). So if I should pay for this new feature, I want it to be better than my "homemade" solution, creating less work for me as a developer.

                             

                            popovers_homemade.png

                            • 11. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                              TimAnderson

                              In support of Bruce here, I have known a few 'developers' who have been with FileMaker since  year dot. Some are not what I would call developers, they don't investigate  or experiment and so they fail to take advantage of everything - or even a fraction - of what FileMaker as a platfprm haas to offer. True develoers never stop learning.

                              In an environment as powerful as FileMaker not everythiung can be obvious, some of the most exciting things I have seen in the last 5 years have not beenm designed but 'discovered' by the likes of Bruce, John Sindelar, Ray Cologon etc.

                              Intex, play around and experiment - sure FileMaker 13 is not perfect but it's better than anything else out there for what most of us do, and it keeps getting better

                               

                              Enjoy

                              • 12. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                                intex

                                erolst schrieb:

                                 

                                Also, IIUC a popup is not intended as a modal dialog window – we already have that.

                                 

                                 

                                Probably not, but as long as the dialogue script step can´t produce full blown dialogues and the modal window doesn´t look like a real dialogue it would be a solution (without using a plugin).

                                • 13. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                                  intex

                                  TimAnderson schrieb:

                                   

                                  Intex, play around and experiment

                                   

                                  that´s what I do all day

                                   

                                   

                                  TimAnderson schrieb:

                                   

                                  sure FileMaker 13 is not perfect

                                   

                                  that´s what I say

                                   

                                   

                                  TimAnderson schrieb:


                                  it keeps getting better

                                   

                                   

                                  yes, that´s true, but with little more thinking FM could be easily ways better years before. For example together with conditional formating they could have had conditional objects easily too. But what, we had to fiddle around with white text on white ground and stuff like that for years.

                                  • 14. Re: New features not designed as well as they could
                                    jormond

                                    I think erolst was referring to the new window script step that allows for 'modal' behavior, which you can use to create dialog that are much better than OS-level and FM default dialogs.  The Show Custom Dialog, I only use for informational purposes.

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